Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Standard & modified running gear
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daniel-b
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Israel
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Custard wrote:
3 months ago
I haven't experience of that gearbox, but from other cars it seems sensible to be like that as it makes it stronger in the side to side movement.

Given the cut outs in the selector rods in the gearbox are invariably square/rectangular to have the bottom rounded would mean less metal actually engaging with the selector rods.

Hopefully someone will give a definitive answer, but I would simply clean it up lightly grease it and fit it.

Sean.
Hi Sean,

Thanks for replying. I was thinking along similar lines. Also, although I've never even seen a picture of one of these gear levers in good condition, there are pictures of a very similar part for the Austin A30 which seems to be flat like that.

Rgds,

Daniel



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daniel-b
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Hi again,

I found the attached pic on the site of an Australian parts vendor. I'd say it's pretty conclusive.

However, there is one more thing. The peg that holds the triangular cup onto the ball is pretty loose. It easily moves from side to side and can be removed if you wiggle it the right way. I am assuming this is not good. Not sure what to do about this. Maybe use circlips to hold it? Or maybe some teflon tape?


Thanks,

D.
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8G900.jpg
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8G900.jpg



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Custard
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by Custard »

I would be reticent to use circlips or anything that could come loose and end up in the gearbox possibly causing more issues.

I would look very carefully at how much movement it needs to come out and how much movement it can have when the gear stick is fitted.

It may well be that it is not an issue as once it is fitted the pin cannot slide out.

Sean.



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daniel-b
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Israel
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Custard wrote:
3 months ago
I would be reticent to use circlips or anything that could come loose and end up in the gearbox possibly causing more issues.

I would look very carefully at how much movement it needs to come out and how much movement it can have when the gear stick is fitted.

It may well be that it is not an issue as once it is fitted the pin cannot slide out.

Sean.
Hi,

It can't actually slide out by itself, because the round middle part of the pin can't get through the rectangular slit in the cup. However it does seem to be capable of quite a lot of side to side movement. I'm not sure how tightly the pin is held in once the whole assembly is bolted together.

Thanks,

D.



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daniel-b
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Custard wrote:
3 months ago
I would be reticent to use circlips or anything that could come loose and end up in the gearbox possibly causing more issues.

I would look very carefully at how much movement it needs to come out and how much movement it can have when the gear stick is fitted.

It may well be that it is not an issue as once it is fitted the pin cannot slide out.

Sean.
Hi again,

I had another look at it today, and I was about to put a little dab of epoxy on the pin to hold it in position, when I realised that the gear stick has to pivot on the pin, and epoxy would prevent this, so I am back to square one. Sideways movement is extreme (although it cannot fall out, it could get itself into a position where it can't re-centre itself), so it looks like circlips is, at present, the best solution I can think of.



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Custard
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by Custard »

Why does it have to pivot on the pin?

The pin is not a tight fit in the housing so wouldn't the pin rotate with the lever if it was epoxied in.

If the pin wont fall out what keeps it in?

Is removing it and making a longer pin a feasible option?

Sean.



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daniel-b
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Hi,

Thanks for replying.

I have attached some pictures.

The pin can't fall all of the way out because the central round part cannot get through the rectangular slits in the cup.

The slits hold the pin still while the gear lever pivots on it while changing gears. If I epoxied the pin inside the hole in the gear lever this would not be possible.

The problem seems to be that the rectangular parts of the pin are worn. There are also grooves on it that may indicate that there were clips on it at some point.

I hope I am missing something obvious here...

Thanks again,

Daniel
Attachments
2021-06-12 23.38.29.jpg
The assembled gear lever with the pin in centered position.
2021-06-12 23.38.29.jpg (113.31 KiB) Viewed 201 times
The assembled gear lever with the pin in centered position.
The assembled gear lever with the pin in centered position.
EXIF-Data show/hide
Original image recording time:
2021:06:12 23:38:29
Image taken on:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:38 pm
Focus length:
4.77 mm
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1/17 Sec
F-number:
f/1.75
ISO speed rating:
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Mi 9T Pro
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2021-06-12 23.35.01.jpg
The pin and the hole it goes in in the gear lever.
2021-06-12 23.35.01.jpg (160.97 KiB) Viewed 201 times
The pin and the hole it goes in in the gear lever.
The pin and the hole it goes in in the gear lever.
EXIF-Data show/hide
Original image recording time:
2021:06:12 23:35:02
Image taken on:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:35 pm
Focus length:
4.77 mm
Shutter speed:
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F-number:
f/1.75
ISO speed rating:
2980
Whitebalance:
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Camera-model:
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2021-06-12 23.33.32.jpg
The extent of sideways movement.
2021-06-12 23.33.32.jpg (104.9 KiB) Viewed 201 times
The extent of sideways movement.
The extent of sideways movement.
EXIF-Data show/hide
Original image recording time:
2021:06:12 23:33:32
Image taken on:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:33 pm
Focus length:
4.77 mm
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F-number:
f/1.75
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2021-06-12 23.33.11.jpg
Side view of the assembled gear lever.
2021-06-12 23.33.11.jpg (115 KiB) Viewed 201 times
Side view of the assembled gear lever.
Side view of the assembled gear lever.
EXIF-Data show/hide
Original image recording time:
2021:06:12 23:33:12
Image taken on:
Sat Jun 12, 2021 10:33 pm
Focus length:
4.77 mm
Shutter speed:
1/17 Sec
F-number:
f/1.75
ISO speed rating:
3646
Whitebalance:
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Flash did not fire, compulsory flash mode
Camera-manufacturer:
Xiaomi
Camera-model:
Mi 9T Pro
Exposure program:
Normal program
Exposure bias:
0 EV
Metering mode:
Center-weighted average



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Custard
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by Custard »

Ah, I understand better with those pictures.

To me it would appear that the grooves are wear grooves rather than for a clip.

Can it actually become detached while in the vehicle?

I think the pin would be unlikely to move sideways as the spring presses it down, however if it has worn and become shorter the only thing I could suggest is lengthen the pin with a couple of blobs of weld and then file down to the correct profile and shorten until it can be assembled out of the car but has insufficient sideways movement to become detached from the cup while bolted into the gear box.

Maybe just a small blob on one end first.

A little bit of fiddling to see how much clearance there is when you disassemble it should show how much could be added while still allowing reassembly.

Also with care so as not to drop it in, you can put the pin in the lever but not in the cup and hold it in position to see how much clearance there is between the ends of the pin and the gearbox housing.

The maximum length is the shorter of the two. What will fit in the box and what will allow reassembly.

Sean.



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daniel-b
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Thanks very much for your input.

I'm going to try (more or less) what you suggest. Next step is obviously some test fittings to see how much play the pin has when installed in the gear box.

It occurs to me that a couple of small blobs of epoxy putty on the pin itself would both allow the pin to move around, and also limit its side movement, if necessary.

I am attaching another picture that I found somewhere. The gearstick on the left is identical to mine, and the pin is obviously not centered, indicating that it can move freely side to side like mine.

Rgds,

Daniel
Attachments
Two gearsticks.jpg
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Two gearsticks.jpg



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Custard
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by Custard »

Yes it will probably move to a favoured side and just stay there because of the spring above it, hence the wear groove.

Until your pictures I hadn't appreciated the change in shape along the length of the pin.

You never stop learning.

Sean.



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daniel-b
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Custard wrote:
3 months ago
Yes it will probably move to a favoured side and just stay there because of the spring above it, hence the wear groove.

Until your pictures I hadn't appreciated the change in shape along the length of the pin.

You never stop learning.

Sean.
Glad to be of service ;).

Thanks for all your help.

D.



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daniel-b
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Re: Series 2 gearbox stuck in reverse

Post by daniel-b »

Hi all,

I installed the new gear lever this evening. I tried the epoxy putty idea, and it didn't work out, so I scraped it off and just installed it as is, making sure the pin was balanced as I lowered the gear lever into the gearbox. First impressions are that gear changing (not actually driving, just waggling the gearstick up and down the gears with the engine off) feels FAR better. See the beginning of this thread for the actual reason that I needed a new gear lever in the first place.

Next stage is to try driving the car. I just need to remember to put the oil that I removed back in...

Thanks to everyone for the help throughout this thread,

Daniel



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